What does it take to stay ahead of the threat? How do we successfully build relationships? Asher Morris answers these questions and so much more on this week’s episode. Asher Morris is a seasoned emergency services and emergency management professional. A trained paramedic, he also has experience in healthcare emergency management as well as coordinating specialized projects for vulnerable populations.
Asher currently serves as the Emergency Preparedness Manager for the City of Atlanta’s Mayor’s Office of Emergency Preparedness.
On this week’s episode, Asher discusses preparing major cities for all types of hazards and major events. He delves into the nuances of emergency preparedness at the local level. He also highlights the importance of leading through serving others first. Through his insights, we learn how to work more effectively within our respective communities as a whole.
[Asher’s comments and opinions are his own and do not represent an official statement from the City of Atlanta Mayor's Office.]
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Host: John Scardena (0s):
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Host: John Scardena (1m 41s):
Welcome back to the show, everybody, it's your host, John Scardena. I am so excited for this episode. After Morris comes to us out of Atlanta, Georgia Mayor's office. He has a very long title for a very long panel, eight to speak both to that, but they're focusing on preparedness. I've been before focusing on the tornado response. It's about 17 or so plus. Asher comes with an additional feather in his cap. If you remember last year, we had Ashley Loria golden on here, big fan of hers and what she's done with mitigation. She's worked with Jima, she's worked with Forsyth county. Now she actually works with Doberman. She just said, hey, you got to have this guy on the show. He's really, really smart. So Asher, welcome to the show.
Guest: Asher Morris (2m 26s):
Thanks so much for having me. I'm excited to be here.
Host: John Scardena (2m 29s):
All right. So first things first, can you give us the entire title? It might be a paragraph or two, but
Guest: Asher Morris (2m 34s):
Yeah, emergency preparedness manager. We have Atlanta mayor's office of emergency preparedness. It’s not so long.
Host: John Scardena (2m 42s):
You guys like preparedness? Yeah. Okay. So I look at preparedness a little bit differently than some based off of my past experiences. We use all these buzz words, resiliency, preparedness, five areas of preparedness FEMA. It, which doesn't really make sense for response. You don't prepare to respond, you actually respond. So I call it readiness. So if you're the preparedness manager, are you focusing on all actions pre disaster or are you actually doing disaster response yourself?
Guest: Asher Morris (3m 13s):
Yeah, the majority of what we do is mostly the preparedness piece as you would traditionally think of it. So we do a lot of special event preparedness, crisis management, pretty much anything, but the recovery and mitigation piece. We even do some mitigation aspects as well. Okay.
Host: John Scardena (3m 28s):
Okay. So that's tough for me because mitigation is preparedness, but you know what mitigation isn't really preparing because it's stopping right. If you're doing mitigation, right? So with national preparedness month happening right now, this is like your month, like your a month to shine. So Atlanta is complex for those who don't know Atlanta, basically it's three seasons of construction and like kind of a rainy season, kind of gets cold, so that's how I know Atlanta. In terms of preparing Atlanta and events that could happen there, especially hazards could happen there. What is your office doing right now to prepare your city?
Guest: Asher Morris (4m 12s):
So, you know, obviously we just faced a lot of severe weather with rain coming through the last several weeks. So we frequently meet with a lot of our teams and make sure that everybody really has their good preparedness plans. Ready. Our role is primarily the cross-organizational coordination. So we reach out to the various departments, make sure that they're ready. And then when it comes time to activate any type of plan, we'll be there to assist in that execution really, if you will. But you know, we prepare for all sorts of things. It's labor day weekend coming up. So we're also looking at all the different, special events that are coming into town and working with the different teams and the different departments and making sure that everybody's got their plans ready and that we're ready to really safely host these events. And we are, we're excited about doing that also.
Host: John Scardena (4m 60s):
Yeah. So that's interesting to think about and preparedness in terms of the live shows. I mean, Atlanta is such a huge hub it's hub, you know, it's Delta Delta's hub, it's kind of the landing ground for so many different things, it has such a rich history in itself. You also have a medical background, right. So going to events and looking at it from that lens, how do you pair actually, I need to ask kind of a fun question first, because if there's a cool concert rolling into town, you're like, Ooh, we gotta do some extra preparedness. Can you get tickets to that? Are you able to like get behind the scenes and start preparing for the event?
Guest: Asher Morris (5m 42s):
I’m Sure I could.
Host: John Scardena (5m 44s):
I was gonna say if you can, you know, there's several concepts I would love to be able to help you out with, but yeah. That's why I volunteer my time. Okay. So in terms of hazards, you're really talking about two separate things. So at the same time you're talking about, obviously flooding major issue down south, especially in the Gulf region, but now you're talking about kind of that, that manmade more like accidental manmade of maybe something is planned, but most likely you're going to have a situation where some accident happens and you have to, you have to manage that. So in terms of your time, how do you differentiate between the manmade stuff and the natural stuff, especially as you're identifying your hazards.
Guest: Asher Morris (6m 30s):
That's a, actually a very difficult question. I don't know if there is much of a differentiation of time spent really we're it's very broad spectrum, right? So we're looking at all of the different things that are happening. We're looking at the weather systems, we're monitoring that, we're looking at our event calendars and monitoring that and working really a lot of times it's with the same teams. So we're really working from multiple angles, with the same groups of people to make sure that we're staying on top of it. I mean, our motto with our team is to stay ahead of the threat. So regardless of threat, regardless of natural versus man-made versus whatever else, our goal is really to stay ahead of it. So for example, one of the things we're already starting to plan for is winter weather. So we're already getting our teams together, discussing winter weather T plans and you know, that that's partly one of the big projects that I work on as well. So we're really full swing ahead, full throttle, going through this winter weather, looking at projects, projections for temperatures for precipitation, and getting really all of our planning stuff together.
Host: John Scardena (7m 33s):
How has the weather you have seen, so at least from my perspective, from a GIS perspective, IT, I deployed a lot more often to the golf than I thought I was going to, you know, 10, 15 years ago as the weather tends to shift and it's changed in those impacts. So it's amazing that you're already looking at that out. I mean, I guess that's preparedness in a sense, right, In it's full sense. As you're looking at that, how have you had to change tactics in terms of your strategic vision for preparing for heavy hitting events that are probably happening more often than what they predicted 20, 30 years ago even? Do you look at that, I mean, do you look at those long term trends? Is that something you care about?
Guest: Asher Morris (8m 23s):
I would say personally, I care about it. Like I said, one of my major projects is winter weather. Actually I oversee all of the warming center operations. So shelters that we set up during for the temperatures, for our individuals experiencing homelessness. So I'm looking at trends and seeing, for example, two years ago, we met the activation criteria at 23 times versus last year, or I'm sorry, three years ago, 23 times last year, two years ago, 34 times, and last year it was like 47 times. We're obviously seeing a significant increase. Then of course you can't forget where we were working through COVID as well in my office has been pretty integral in that, in everything COVID. So, yeah.
Host: John Scardena (9m 7s):
Absolutely. It was like all hands on deck, like last year and a half and it's going to keep rolling out, especially as the COVID response is intertwined with so many other areas that it requires true emergency managers to really focus on that, especially because you have a medical background even better. Yeah. It, it made me think, like, you're talking about the increase, go into some of the reasons why you think that increase happens. Do you think it's purely just because of the weather, or do you think it's because knowledge is like, you know, there's like a lot of knowledge growth of like that these warming centers are available. Is that a growing homeless population? What are some of the factors that go into those warming centers?
Guest: Asher Morris (9m 51s):
Yeah. So we're very metric based when it comes to the activation. So we meet specific temperature or other criteria and we activate, so, I mean, I think it's definitely an increase in cold weather that we're seeing the last couple of years. You know, last winter, we got very lucky we didn't, I don't believe we saw a single snowflake, which for Atlanta is not totally unheard of. That's actually one of the things I love most about Atlanta, you can really kind of see all four seasons in one day, some years, but it is, it's one of the selling points that I think, you know, in the middle of the fall, you've got all four seasons. Maybe you'll see a flurry here and there, but I definitely think it has to do with the weather. It's the temperatures, the temperatures are dropping and lasting longer. You know, some days we'll have, or some weeks we'll have a cold snap that lasts one day and sometimes it'll last three days in a row and we have to have contingency to keep our operation open.
Host: John Scardena (10m 45s):
Yeah. That's interesting. So our company Doberman emergency management, we've been heavily dealing with the impacts of weather on the opposite side bed, the heat side, because of California. We actually still have an operation. We moved our headquarters recently to St. Louis where I'm at now, but we have an office in LA and in California specific and it really is a nationwide issue of power outages, but the utility company was found liable for these major wildfires. So they were told that they had to put a plan in place. This is really just for the audience state for a lot of those emergency managers who don't know about this, but they created something called public safety power shutoffs.
Host: John Scardena (11m 26s):
Basically they think the wind or the weather, the heat was the right combination of factors was going to cause a wildfire from their power lines. They were going to kill the power. Well, now we have cooling centers. Now we have to deal with cooling centers without power and so our company, you know, we were poised to be able to work in that environment. We were, I would say very grateful and, and having to feel to obtain clients there and said, hey, we want to do this right. So a big part of our plan is those homeless populations. Really, you know, we also work with tribes and tribes can bring in a lot of money through casinos, or they can be desperately in need for assistance and work off of grants.
We have been focusing on those that need, you know assistance and so pulling all that in together and looking at that coordination piece of how you get to the generators, the fuel that's needed, how do you maintain that? Who are your stakeholders? Who has responsibility during that event? And really when you look at those types of events, it's that coordination piece between all those stakeholders, which amazingly smartly, you called out at the beginning and said, hey, mostly what I do is coordination. So in terms of the national preparedness month perspective, our podcast is kind of taking the spin that we want to prepare our emergency managers for the future. You know, as emergency managers, prepare the public, as you're focusing on the public, what advice could you give to emergency managers who might have to deal with cold snaps or deal with those heating, you know, those heat waves that are going to have to deal with car cold centers for the homeless, what are like maybe top five things that they should focus on as they do?
Guest: Asher Morris (13m 10s):
Yeah. So I think number one, and I would be hard pressed to find an emergency manager who disagrees, people's relationships, our job, everything we do, whether it's specifically preparedness or whether it's consequence management, no matter what it is, we need resources. We need to work with people and we really have to understand that it does take off in a village. It's a whole community approach. So building those relationships are that that's number one, that's that's by far the top tip proactivity, start early and make things happen. Build these relationships early, start planning early, knowing your, your stakeholders, knowing what their capabilities are, I think is extremely important and trying to understand what others can bring to the table. You know, we don't want to have a response where everybody says, hey, I'm in, but nobody knows what to do. So starting early with the coordination piece, hey, you're going to be responsible for X. You're going to be responsible for Y, you're going to be responsible for Z. I'm big on thinking with innovation, right? So last year I might have done something one way and it could have worked perfectly, but what can we do differently this year? What can we do better this year you know, to enhance our engagement with our community, to enhance our engagement with our stakeholders, whether it's the community or the internal stakeholders. You know, to me that, that that's extremely important, right?
We want to continue to grow, continue to evolve, continue to just do better. Be creative, have fun with it. You know, a lot of people look at what we do and say, okay, so we follow plans, we do this, we do that, whatever. We've got a plan, we've got a playbook, we've got a framework. It might be right, but have fun with it. You know, our plans should be living documents. Let's do something different. Let's break the glass ceiling if you will, let's do something. So innovation is another big one when I say productivity. Yeah so be proactive. I mean, those are really the top three. I don't know if I can come up with two more proactivity, start early, build these relationships and really keep thinking creatively, be innovative and, and just try to do better everyday should be better than the neck, the previous one every year, every season, whatever it might be.
Host: John Scardena (15m 26s):
Yes. I fought this tooth and now until I did one, one agency did a really well, hey, I like innovation. I'm going to go in there and we're going to kind of blow this whole thing up and see what we can do. Another agency fought me tooth and nail. I still got what I wanted, which was, I was lucky enough to work with a really good boss, but it was mind boggling. The concept of, well it's worked before. So why change it well in emergency management? What worked before was great for before, you're not preparing for the future, you're not addressing the needs of the future and or the capabilities that are coming out. You know, the big one with me was my big claim to fame is that I introduced drones to FEMA. We're not talking about the high altitude drones because we manage the high altitude drones, we manage the satellites. The Cessna is, which are worthless, sorry, Cessna pilots. But like these tactical little drones that most people think are toys when they're at 200 feet up in the air and you're getting situational ground truth and you're doing damage assessments, when you're doing debris pile estimations in a fraction of the time. When you go to Congress and they say, how did you determine your debris pile? You've got $5 million of debris. Well, this is the actual calculation that we got from the drone that, you know, it takes, it takes an account of the donut shape of the debris pile and helps out a lot in a lot faster.
I can't even tell you how hard it was to be able to convince people. Basically, we had to trick, the system. We were at a disaster, it was actually in Georgia. We were in Georgia and it was for a Warner Robbins for a tornado and we heard of another federal agency having drones and say, hey, can you just show us what you do with those drones? So they came out, they showed us what it was like and then you fast forward to hurricane Harvey and you have 700,000 homes literally impacted. So like what are you going to do? And the FEMA administrator at the time, Brock Long said to everyone at FEMA, be innovative, get the job done, be innovative.
So I went over to legal and I said, the head of the agencies said be innovative. Can I get a drone? And they said, sure, great. I mean, it was not as a longer process of that, but I got the drone, we showcased it, we went out to one fi wildfire with it, and I did myself in one other spotter did. We found 33 more homes than a 30 person PDA team and a third amount of time at almost no cost. So innovation works. So to the audience out there, that's innovation and an action. So to your point, yeah, good call outs.
Guest: Asher Morris (18m 16s):
No, a lot of people stay. We can't and we don't want to recreate the wheel. I'm a huge proponent of that, we shouldn't recreate the wheel. If a plan exists, let's not recreate a plan. But taking that plan at, or taking that wheel, if you will, adding an additional spoke, enhancing it, shining the tire now, whatever it is, make it better. Because like you said, what happened last year isn't the same as what happens this year, you know. Plans again, they're black and white, but we have to be able to pivot. We have to be able to really just see something might be different. So let's think outside the box, let's be innovative and creative. So I'm big on that.
Host: John Scardena (18m 51s):
Yeah. Switching out for snow tires, right? Yeah. So you talked about living documents, I'm a big fan of living documents. It's one of my biggest problems and maybe you can even address this. I'm now a contractor. I kind of hate this, it kind of makes me like die inside a little bit like, oh, contractor, consultant as I'm an emergency manager first. I only work with people who've been in the field, but as soon as you go to an agency, they're like, oh, consultant, you know, like how much money do you want? You're like, okay, well I do need to get paid for the work I do, but I like create living documents. There’s this problem right now with consultants is they're so focused on like the FEMA checklist. I've looked at a document where like half of it was definition.
So I was actually, this is a really, I've shared this one before in the podcast. They had a definition for a volcano for a plan for Philadelphia. I was like, why is this in here? Right. So how do you create living documents? Maybe, can you dress that other concern of how do you work with outside sources? If you're talking about collaboration, we can do everything yourself. Where's the middle ground of making sure you have high expectations, as well as allowing that to have some wiggle room.
Guest: Asher Morris (20m 7s):
Yeah. So, I mean, first of all, technology is great. So having living documents is easy at this point because you can just put it online, put it on a one drive or something to that effect, whatever platform you use and work through that, share it with different people, have different people look through it as far as the collaboration piece and how you do that and do it effectively. You know, I think, again, it's important when I'm working through, let's say a special event, for example, I'm not always going to be the subject matter expert on, you know, what this department will do, what, I'm not a police officer. So I can't tell the police what to do. We're not a firefighter, so I can't tell the fire department what to do. I don't work in public work, so I can't tell them what to do. So for me, collaboration really, and keeping these documents alive is saying, hey, you're the subject matter expert on this. I'll review it and make sure that the principles make sense. We'll review it together as a group and maybe we'll put together, you know, an executive committee, if you will, to look through this and we'll all have an input, but I'm not the expert. I'm just good at writing these plans or I'm good at reviewing these plans and making sure, you know, that's what my training is. So really understanding and helping others understand like, hey, I'm not the boss of you, I'm just the guy here who's going to help you get this on paper and, and help it work with the other documents that we're going to see.
Then really, it's just making sure everybody's kind of on the same page in that sense, hey, office A is going to be doing this, office B you're going to be doing this. How is that going to affect? Or how is your actions going to affect the other actions? And then how's that going to affect the entire system? So it's a lot of talking to people, a lot of working with people, you know, I enjoy the face-to-face conversations. We've learned a lot in the last year and a half about zoom and teams and all the other online platforms, but really it's FaceTime. It's those relationships building that and building that trust so that they understand like, hey, you're not trying to take my plan. We're trying to build a collaborative plan.
I think that's really important that trust and the relationship that you have. And again, I guess it goes back to what I was saying before we have to build relationships. That's really what we need to do. You know, when I talk to people about what it is that emergency managers do, I say, look, building relationships. Here's an example, if I'm walking on the street and somebody says, hey man, can I have a dollar? I'm going to look at them now, I often don't carry cash on me. So I'll probably say, sorry, I don't have cash. But if it's somebody I know, and they're saying, hey, I really need this dollar to, you know, get out of the parking lot or buy something, buy a drink. If I know them, and we've built that relationship, I'm more inclined to say you got it. As opposed to the person who I've never met before, never seen before. That might take a little bit more effort for me to be like, you know what, hold on. Let me walk to the ATM and get you this. So that's kind of the example I use when I explain to people why it's so important to build that relationship. We're so much more tend to be, as people and this is not just me, but everybody we're so much more giving often when it's the people that we know that are close to us. So as emergency managers, as people who work in preparedness, we have to build those relationships because at some point I'm going to need a chainsaw, you know, and I have to know the person I'm going to ask for it. Otherwise we'll be like, actually, the other guy asked for it already. Sorry, man. So yeah, it's all about relationship building.
Host: John Scardena (23m 39s):
I'm looking at the time here, you just had like 15 different areas that I like a hundred percent I agree with. So just like kind of rapid fire. Haven't used that term in a while in the show, but we used to do this, like rapid-fire thing where like, you're going to ask like four or five really quick questions, get their answers really fast. Always turned into like a 45 minute conversation. That had to die. But yeah. So two weeks ago on the show, I talked about unselfishly, just helping other people. If they don't return the favor, then you did something good in the world and you can be proud for the work you did, but more likely than not, hey, like building that relationship on selfishly, helping other people.
That's like a big thing of building relationships. Another big one for me is like, what? You're just calling out. Like the big secret of our field is whoever came up with the term emergency manager was ingenious because we don't really have any authority to tell all these other people what to do, but they hear emergency manager so they, hey DOT can you make me that one road with clear? Oh yeah. The emergency manager told me to get that done. We're like, cool.
Guest: Asher Morris (24m 50s):
We are the managers of relationships.
Host: John Scardena (24m 53s):
Managers of relationships. I like that. I really think we should be called emergency coordinators because like the best emergency manager is a current coordinator, but managing relationships is totally true. And like, when you can manage and you understand a relationship, I felt, you know, one of my best friends, he's been on the show a few times, his name is Patrick McGuinn and he's with salvation army. We used to be on the national strike team together when he asked for something for the company or just for me like, hey, can you volunteer some of your time to help? But you know, he, we did an active shooter class for his, for his headquarters. Happy to do it volunteer the time because a friend asked, you know, at the same time we just had a client calls up and say, hey, we're out of water.
Our company doesn't do water. We can tell them where to go. But I called Patrick up and I said, hey, Salvation Srmy can do water. Right, and he goes, yeah, happy to help. So like, just knowing what they can do, it saves a lot of time when you get into a meeting and somebody goes now what? That's when it's like, oh this is going to be a really tough meeting. But when you get in a response and everybody's walking in the room and you see already people talking to each other and they sit on the table and they start going through a who does what? A response or preparing a fair, whatever, you know, just understanding that and having that relationship is so huge. Right?
Guest: Asher Morris (26m 17s):
So it helps you understand their capacity, their capability, right. If you don't know them to start with, then you have to start the meeting from square one and say, all right. So tell me what you guys can.
Host: John Scardena (26m 25s):
And then it's like half and half the meanings introductions. And you're like, oh man, what a huge waste of time. Could this have been an email? Right. Okay. All right. I have a real question, something that I get asked a lot something, I have to like dive into quite a bit emergency managers here, it's all about collaboration working with your stakeholders. Not all parties get along, some parties are definitely top down some parties that have no relationship whatsoever. As, as you, as a guy who is, seems pretty expert in building those relationships, what advice would you be for emergency managers of how to start building relationships? Like what does square one of doing that?
Guest: Asher Morris (27m 8s):
Introductions. You know, hey, I'm so and so, this is what I can bring to the table. I think, you know, I'm really lucky in every environment that I've worked in, especially over the last couple of years, I've not run into that power struggle. It's really, everybody is interested in working together. That's one of the things that I really enjoy about working here at the city. It's we know that we have a job to do, and we know that we have to get that job done. We know that we have to work together to do it. But realistically it's finding that common ground, you know, you might be opposing entities, you might be competitors. If we were looking at a larger scale event, let's say, or even a disaster, you might be working with your competitor.
At the end of the day, we have to put egos aside. We have to realize that our purpose in collaborating, it's not for us. It's not for me, it's not for my name, it's not for my office, it's really for the people we serve. It's the people who have been affected by this disaster. So I like to try to say, even something like that, if I'm working with a group, who's having a hard time getting, you know, getting along, we have to find our common ground and recognize that we have one mission. Our mission is to help people and if we can't put our differences aside, really to help people, you know, to me, Ill personally speak to myself. If I ever get to a place where I can't put myself aside to help somebody else, I'm going to say, I might need to take a break or I meant to step out.
But we're talking about hopefully a group of professionals who got into this field because we enjoy one helping people, but also, you know, I have different reasons for why I got in here as well. I like seeing something that's chaotic and turning it into something a little bit less chaotic, more organized if you will. If we can't put that aside and say, look, I might not like you, our families might be mortal enemies, but we're here for the same thing and that's to make sure that what we have to do gets done so that this person, or this group of people, or this community, or the city, this county, this state, whatever it might be, can really get back off their feet or onto their feet and off the ground. I think normally I try to use phraseology like that and just say, look, common mission, one mission or one team. We have to do this.
Host: John Scardena (29m 24s):
Mic drop moment. That's the microphone of the show and it did perfectly because I swear you must have looked at our disaster top, all the audience taking this out right now, our Instagram page, because quote, that was literally shared today, emergency management puts people first and management helps people, a job where humanitarians. I think 90% of the field that we got into it cause we like helping people. I also really liked. So this better be a quote on our, this is a call out for our show too, for what you just said, emergency managers like seeing chaos and seeing if we can organize it. That challenge is really fun and I think that's a great call-out for somebody who does preparedness, you better start doing some response because you are really good at the response stuff. What you just said also, if you already know all the key stakeholders, you better start getting a response cause they could use somebody like you so big call-out to Asher for just having high skill there. Yeah. Thanks again for coming on the show. I just want to call out one more time that our grateful that you came on that the talk about the city of Atlanta a little bit and really providing great guidance to emergency managers on directing them towards future actions. This month is all about helping out the public figure out. Oh, we got these four ideas that we want to talk about. No. What really is important is to look at the future events, adjust where necessary. That's what you said, build those relationships. Now, understanding capability, just introduce yourself and seeing what you can do. All those are really great call-outs and so I appreciate you coming on the show and I hope we have you back on the show soon, actually. Thank you. Thank you so much. Yeah.
Okay. Everybody, this is the call-out so lame. I got to do it every week though. But if you like this show, you got to give us a five star rating and subscribe. And like I said, it's lame, but it helps us out a lot. It helps us track, hey, for were successful or not. We really liked this episode, obviously we just called out Asher for those good comments that he made on the show. So make sure that you send us a message, let us know on Instagram, Facebook, Twitter, LinkedIn, whatever. Let us know what you thought about this episode. If you agree to, if you disagreed, if you disagreed, you're probably wrong because I thought it was a great episode and I'm his second witness for sure. So let's do this. Get on there, let us know if you want to work with Doberman emergency management or you had an idea about what Asher city had a question that we can forward him. Please send it to us at info@dobermanemg.com and we'll see you next week.